Author Topic: Questions concerning a setup using sceptre cab and 410sr's  (Read 3121 times)

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Offline Slumm

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Questions concerning a setup using sceptre cab and 410sr's
« on: August 29, 2013, 04:36:54 am »
Alright, I've been scouring this forum for about a year now, carefully sifting through when I required it, but up until now I haven't really had need to post, but I'm finally putting together my setup and just wondering if I can get some feedback on what I'm envisioning it to sound like.

So to put it all together, starting a heavy 60's style acid-bathed drone freakout band (think Amon Düül II mixed with FlowerTravellinBand and a sinister Les Rallizes Dénudés) and I'm looking to incorporate an older cab that I've had with some other gear I've accumulated as well as investing in some new stuff for this band.

I'd be playing a totally funky brandless 60's Japanese 12 string electric through Correct Sound Custom's Tube Beta Hybrid pedal in which the Model T channel would be slaving out to a Sunn Alpha Four PA(100w) driving a 1968 Sceptre 412s(4x C12R, rated 25w rms)
on top of That(!) I would be pushing the beta channel out to a 1975 Coliseum Slave(320w), running 2 wedge 410sr's(120w rms a piece).

I know the 410sr's are P.A. speakers but I've been researching one of the sets of 10's(108g) in one of the 410sr's and it seems might might be close to what I had running in a Beta Lead Combo which sounded great, and the others are Extended range(?) I guess for highs, but I can't find much info on them. The 108g transducers are rated 40w rms, so x4 would put it at 160w, but the backplates rate it at 100w(?) pushing both with the coliseum fairly loud shouldn't hurt them if I'm correct???

The Sceptre is all original pretrademark badge first run, og jensens, and from what I hear are warm with low and mids and have great clean brights, somewhere say they peak at 50w which theoretically would put damage levels around 150-200w, but if I'm only powering it with a 100w ss slave amp am I in danger when cranking?
What I'm mostly concerned about is running safe peak levels on the power amps and being confident what won't damage the speakers before I go and obliviously toast them into buzzland.
Not gonna lie, I like to dime but I can be conservative, just wondering if I have too powerful of amps for this cabinet config for it to be safe.

Waiting in the mail for the tube beta hybrid, and picking up the 410sr's for a couple bills.

Any ideas or info on any of these questions would seriously be so helpful, most of my fidelity friendly friends are mostly into other brands.
Thanks for reading this ramble. Hopefully some pics in the coming weeks as it comes together.
here's the site for the pedal I'm talking about
http://correctsoundcustom.com/index/0-12#!/~/product/category=2244169&id=22665455
Cheers!
-Slumm

Offline Isaac

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Re: Questions concerning a setup using sceptre cab and 410sr's
« Reply #1 on: August 29, 2013, 11:46:52 am »
Personally, I think you're pushing the limits. Speaker power handling ratings are always an estimate. I think the Sunn ratings were based on a clean signal. Heavily distorted signals carry a lot more power than clean signals, due to the extra harmonic content. So an amp rated at 100 watts pushing a full-on square wave at full output would be putting out closer to 200 watts. Another factor in speaker power handling is rest time. Most music has loud sections and softer, along with rests where no music is played at all. This gives the drivers time to dissipate heat. A drone band would seem to have much less time for the drivers to recover, much more time spent at full output. In short, I would not be at all surprised if you burned out those forty-year-old drivers running them as you propose.
Isaac

Offline Slumm

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Re: Questions concerning a setup using sceptre cab and 410sr's
« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2013, 03:03:55 pm »
Cool, I was wanting to keep these speakers in good shape by carefully monitoring use but I don't really know how. Should I get something like a limiter? I can deal with lower amp output levels while bumping up the speaker count. I'm young and strong, I really don't mind moving big cabs all day if it means I won't be damaging them by pushing higher levels with less cabs to get a desired volume and tone.
So would you suggest even keeping the dial at less than half on the Alpha Slave with a massive fuzz pedal would be damaging to the sceptre cab?
And then running the 2x 410's through the coliseum at a reduced output (around the same level) could be fine?

Not trying for SUNN(band) style drone, much more like heavy cultish prog style with plenty of clean, as well as dirty(proto metal?).
Plus the preamp I'm getting is essentially an ABY so I can cherry pick the heavy tones to come through the more ample cabs, while giving the older cabs a break.
Just trying to milk the vintage tone without stretching the udders.
and mixing it with booze for good measure.

Offline Isaac

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Re: Questions concerning a setup using sceptre cab and 410sr's
« Reply #3 on: August 30, 2013, 01:33:14 pm »
The position of the dial isn't necessarily relevant. It depends on how hard the amp is being pushed. The amp can be pushed to max output by a relatively small input signal with the dial all the way up, or by a larger signal with it turned down.
Isaac